View Full Version : 10th Planet: is it bjj?
Brandon Quick
05-16-2009, 07:28 PM
is 10th Planet: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu????
younwha
05-16-2009, 08:51 PM
Good questions... but then again what specifies what is BJJ and what isn't? Can someone train in BJJ under an instructor that isn't officially ranked in BJJ? When a guy in JKD is training grappling is he doing BJJ...
Personally I think all Martial Arts are wrapped up into each other, and in all honesty I think giving specific names and specific styles is silly. If you're a Martial Artist you should be
interested in learning all aspects of 'fighting' thus there shouldn't be a need for labels.
"I'm a student of life. I'm a student of Martial Arts."
But to actually answer your question lol ... sure it is, why not? But 10th Planet is no more/less BJJ, than JKD is Wing Chung.
I agree with Younwha saying all martial arts are wrapped up into each other. Well said.
As for 10th Planet being BJJ, damned if I know. I guess that would be for you 10th Planet and BJJ guys to say.
I've been under the impression that a lot of the 10th Planet stuff was first developed exclusively there, and by Eddie. Yes? No?
If that's the case, then it should be attributed to him.
Don't much matter to me, both are fantastic, beautiful and balls to the wall effective.
Mdrnsamurai
05-16-2009, 09:14 PM
Obviously it has some attachment to BJJ, since it's founder is a Black Belt in that discipline. However, since the Style has moved away from the use of the Gi it becomes closer to Submission Wrestling and Vale Tudo rather then Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. It will always have some connection to BJJ but as it evolves it will eventually become a separate discipline able to stand on it's own.
The fact the 10th Planet has already moved so far away from the conventional wisdom of BJJ just proves that it is a evolutionary system forging it's own path.
Train Hard, Stay Safe,
Good Luck
Martin
05-16-2009, 11:48 PM
I would say that 10th planet is the cooler, better looking, better with girls, cousin to BJJ
Twister-Australus
05-17-2009, 01:27 AM
is it from brazil?
prodigypenn
05-17-2009, 08:57 AM
its origins,. the root of the system come from brazil, ie brazilian jiu-jitsu/gracie jiu-jitsu, but 10th planet today is pretty much an american version of the brazilian version of the japanese art
Ghosted3
05-17-2009, 10:25 AM
Classic GJJ/BJJ is like an old atlas or road map... It will get you where you need to go just fine.
10thP is kind of like a GPS system... Newer, alternate directions to the same location that are at times quicker and more fun.
*edit* - This coming from a guy who likes to roll in the pajamas.
Kaije727
05-17-2009, 10:59 AM
I would say that 10th planet is the cooler, better looking, better with girls, cousin to BJJ
+1 :D :rolleyes:
summitcitysubmissions
05-17-2009, 11:42 AM
in my opinion BJJ guys tend to bang on no-gi or in this case 10th planet and say its not BJJ just because we dont wear the gi.
tell me this does that mean that the BJJ player that gets into the cage and arm bars someone isn't doing BJJ?
thats just my 2 cents.
is 10th Planet: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu????
Logically we all understand that it is all just grappling.
So the question is kind of a trick questions since it lacks context.
For example; is Green Day a punk band? From a time-line musical history perspective... obviously Green Day is not punk since they weren't in New York, UK, or LA in the early 80s. However they do use elements of punk music so from a "sounds like" genre perspective.. Green Day can be considered punk (sometimes).
Modern Martial Arts discourse really lacks that contextual continuity. In the past the name of the martial art used to define a region, person, or general philosophy under which the martial art was practiced.
Currently, some people seem to assume that martial arts are defined by stylistic differences or even by the varying differences in competitive rules between one art form and another. Maybe this perspective is from the "gaming" out of Japanese martial arts after WWII? Where martial arts were subdivided until a single aspect of the fight could be expressed through a game which only reflected one dimension of the fighting experience (Judo, Kendo, etc).
So from a time-line perspective, 10th Planet is not BJJ. 10th Planet is clearly Eddie Bravo (and his pupils') take on grappling defining a clear beginning point at which everybody took their own path and observations.
From a style perspective... it is BJJ (sometimes).
Tallsilkyslim
05-17-2009, 01:08 PM
Classic GJJ/BJJ is like an old atlas or road map... It will get you where you need to go just fine.
10thP is kind of like a GPS system... Newer, alternate directions to the same location that are at times quicker and more fun.
*edit* - This coming from a guy who likes to roll in the pajamas.
Great analogy Correy!!!
Completely different games in my opinion. However, I feel that wearing a Gi and using certain 10th Planet stuff like Rubber Guard also works very well.
However, two completely different yet strikingly similar games with two separate forms of conditioning needed
From Green Day punk to mention of contextual continuity.
Brother, twist me one up!
Ari Bolden
05-17-2009, 05:32 PM
They are 2 different games-both fun but 10th Planet is based on BJJ in many ways. Is it BJJ? I don't think so because the attack and philosophy behind the combat is different. They are cousins maybe?
Showtime
05-17-2009, 08:27 PM
I think of it as an awesome add-on to BJJ. It's just an alternate path to submitting your opponent. Eddie has said you have to know both. He was talking about breaking somebody down into mission control and if that fails you need to go wrist control. When 10th planet was established, it was established in a BJJ school under a BJJ master. It may have come a long way since then, but I still think of it as BJJ.
JStaver
05-17-2009, 08:54 PM
People have heated debates on GJJ vs. BJJ so I don't think there's ever going to be a consensus when it comes to the recognition or classification of no-gi and/or 10th Planet. I personally view no-gi and 10th Planet to be specialized sub-forms of BJJ.
Mdrnsamurai
05-17-2009, 09:02 PM
BJJ, it's all Judo to me. 10th Planet acts and feels like something entirely different. So far, 10th Planet seems to have a much better attitude then BJJ. All the techniques and innovation without the apparent ego.
Train Hard, Stay Safe,
Good Luck
BJJ is to 10thPJJ as Shotokan Karate is to Muay Thai. Generally one is more traditional, and each has their own unique and effective methods to getting the job done.
IMO.
I think of it as an awesome add-on to BJJ. It's just an alternate path to submitting your opponent. Eddie has said you have to know both. He was talking about breaking somebody down into mission control and if that fails you need to go wrist control. When 10th planet was established, it was established in a BJJ school under a BJJ master. It may have come a long way since then, but I still think of it as BJJ.
That's a good analogy.
It's like an Expansion Pack to a game you already love!
Martin
05-18-2009, 05:39 AM
Kind of like your girlfriend except with much larger breasts and puts out a hell of a lot more.
Nathan
05-18-2009, 10:22 AM
They are 2 different games-both fun but 10th Planet is based on BJJ in many ways. Is it BJJ? I don't think so because the attack and philosophy behind the combat is different. They are cousins maybe? -Ari Bolden
Can someone enlighten me to what the attack and philosophy difference is in 10th Planet to BJJ?
Is it still attacking weaker joints (body points) with more body force just in a different way?
And if so, is it not then just a sub-specialty of submission grappling?
Showtime
05-18-2009, 07:15 PM
That's a good analogy.
It's like an Expansion Pack to a game you already love!
Pretty much exactly what I was thinking!
Ghosted3
05-19-2009, 12:33 AM
Can someone enlighten me to what the attack and philosophy difference is in 10th Planet to BJJ?
Is it still attacking weaker joints (body points) with more body force just in a different way?
And if so, is it not then just a sub-specialty of submission grappling?
Different routes to the same ending.
Can someone enlighten me to what the attack and philosophy difference is in 10th Planet to BJJ?
Is it still attacking weaker joints (body points) with more body force just in a different way?
From what I can gather Eddie seems to be really focused on attacking from the clinch (via rubber guard tactics) and control positions.
Achieving the clinch in 10th Planet seems to be done via wrestling tactics (ie, over hooks, under hooks, gable grips, etc.) where as most BJJ practitioners still attempt to utilize wrist control and standard closed guard for control.
BJJ definitely utilizes grappling tactics however they don't seem so keen on abandoning wrist control concepts for no gi. Me, I have small hands and a weak grip so wrist control is almost impossible for me to achieve without a gi.
Anybody, feel free to correct me if I am wrong as I am a 10th Planet outsider and am just speaking from observation.
zaxonortesus
05-19-2009, 03:56 PM
K- Art
P- Martial Arts
C- Submission Arts
O- Jiu Jitsu
F- Brazilian Jiu Jitsu
G- 10th Planet Jiu Jitsu
S- Rubber Guard
vs.
K- Art
P- Martial Arts
C- Submission Arts
O- Jiu Jitsu
F- Brazilian Jiu Jitsu
G- Gracie Jiu Jitsu
S- Double Wrist Control Closed Guard
Seems to me they are both BJJ, just different genera.
Brandon Quick
05-24-2009, 06:56 PM
who has the MTRG and MTT books?
if you do please open them and look at the flow charts-together.
how much of the system is RG?
this is what sells mind you. passing, other bjj basics and takedowns are not included:)
how much of the system that you see in the books are RG?
zaxonortesus
05-24-2009, 07:40 PM
I have both books, very little of it is Rubber Guard proper, but the majority is 10th planet specific moves... As it should be. If I wanted to learn closed guard, double wrist control moves, I would look at Nogeria's book, not Eddie's, which is specifically why I own that book as well. No offense to Eddie at all, but Rodrigo is a better guard/wrist control player. I wouldn't buy a book on TSC with Pedro Sauer on the cover. If I wanted a very techincal breakdown of BJJ, I would go for a book by him. Everyone has their own speciality inside BJJ, Eddie has just taken that specialty to an extreme and done very well with developing it, and thank the lord he did!
My coach is not a fan of the system at all, like AT ALL, I have heard him say "if you pull that rubber guard stuff, I'll kick you off of my mats!" (he has his reasons, I don't agree with them, but we had a nice discussion about it one day) but SO MANY times, I will pull a sweep from one of the books that nobody knows how to counter and pull it off. Now, is it BJJ or 10P at that point? It's one in the same, its using 10P moves in a broader BJJ scope. Still BJJ.
The one area that skews the lines between BJJ and 10P is the allowance of certain moves in competition. But as with any new move, it needs to be seen and scrutinized by the governing body before it is brought in or thrown out. I think the "guilty until proven innocent" mindset of 10P has more to do with who is in control of the competitions than anything and is more than a little unfair. Ok, that was a lot longer rant to further my POV than I expected, I hope that is what you were getting at Brandon.
Mdrnsamurai
05-24-2009, 09:02 PM
BJJ is it Judo? Guess What? Yes it is.
The first three videos are Sensei Oda, Join 9th Dan. He was almost single handily responsible for Newaza Training at the Kodokan. Do the techniques look familiar? He died in 1955
Y1pZkv1trEI
T7tk8cQ1VJ8
_of8P71itic
This video is Sensei Mifune, Kyuzo 10th Dan. Another Judo genius. Do the techniques look familiar? He died in 1965
korAyURbW6c
This video is Sensei Kimura, Masahiko 7th Dan. Perhaps you have heard of him? Do these techniques look familiar? He died in 1993. He was a 5th Dan at age 18.
BVE82gH-v-g
This video is Sensei Hirata, Kanae 7th Dan. He died in 1998. A fine exponent of Kosen Judo. Judo as it was practiced before WW II
xjidQQz1yjM
Judo prior to WW II was much different then it's modern example, so perhaps 10th Planet can be viewed in the same light. As it continues to evolve, many years from now it will be viewed in the very same way.
Just a thought.
Train Hard, Stay Safe,
Good Luck
naturalbornfighter1
05-25-2009, 02:14 AM
Didn't the twister come from wrestling? I think 10th planet is a form of jiu-jitsu but using Wrestling influences as well as using Flexibility as a key factor. Incorporating the high guard from the bottom and top and using the legs like extra arms makes it so unique.
who has the MTRG and MTT books?
if you do please open them and look at the flow charts-together.
how much of the system is RG?
this is what sells mind you. passing, other bjj basics and takedowns are not included:)
how much of the system that you see in the books are RG?
haha
I actually bought MTRG for the half guard game and I bought MTT for all of the top game stuff.
everything else is a bonus.
vBulletin® v3.6.5, Copyright ©2000-2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.